Posted by Farmer on December 14, 2011 at 19:57:25
In Reply to: Re: We have got a conversation started, haven't we? posted by CS on December 14, 2011 at 13:31:58:
After my experience in TF I am defending my right to us Xmas as much as I like without someone making something out of it. I read the rules and this is not the place to preach about christian-approved terms for Xmas.
what is christian-approved in the light of your comment 6)...there is then more than one contradiction in your thread:
How do (or don't) you celebrate Xmas and New Year? Have your experiences in TF left an imprint on you? How do you feel about Santa, commercialism, the giving of presents and celebrations in general?
I take it you are talking about Christmas?
Well in that case, what the hell are you talking about?
If you were in the cult and read the same hogwash and rejected it you would understand what this is about.
But seeing as you don't, it begs the questions: Have you ever been in the cult? Are you still in it? Have you rejected the hogwash? Are you not familiar with the reasons others use such terms? Or what is it you are trying to teach here?
I know a lot of Christians who have no problem with Xmas because X is a symbol of the cross to them. It's just Berg and his drivel who made a big thing out of it and banned everyone from using Xmas. Merry Xmas to you, FH. If you think I just insulted your religion, too bad. Go to Journeys to do your preaching. Not here.
The point is...you're at the minimum inconsistant at point 3) with the rest of yours...for you defend indirectly.."directly" (concluded from 6, kind of)... the stance of many people, that in X-mas X stands for Greek Chi...((whereas from the following it could be reasonably debatable...whether someone has another intention/agenda or not...for x is also used in "pictorial"...semiotic..way to say: erased...over with...stopping etc....as evident in many sign-boards in demonstrations etc.))
Take xylon in Greek...or xylology...the x is not the x in Christos but the Xi...pronounced ks...and written entirely different...seen from the Greek alphabet below and any Greek dictionary for "x"ylon
xylon is pronouned something like ksülon...ü (vowel-mutation)is part of the German alphabet and also no Problem for the Turks ; ) to pronounce and whoever else (Chinese I think so too)...like the French in surprise...I think modern Greek it's rather pronounced i like in Greece it is pronounced
So you can realise, that our westernised..latin...italic x is kind of ambiguous in X-mas, for pronounced it is iks-mas and not ch-mas...which would pose anyway problems to the average English-speaker???!!!... ; ) So X is by letter...written association... identical to the majuscel form of Chi for writing Ch ristos...thus there is some misleading in the nature of pronounciation...note, that in ancient Greek the Xi...pronounced ks...is in writing different...hence the ambiguity and thus also some suspicion...that all is not right with pacifying the "Anti...X...in X-mas"...faction...to which you might count me as well...it's just playing mindgames with people using the ambiguity...I figure
The "red" (western) type also lacks Phoenician-derived Ξ for /ks/, but instead introduces a supplementary sign for that sound combination at the end of the alphabet, Χ. In addition, the red alphabet also introduced letters for the aspirates, Φ = "pʰ" and Ψ = "kʰ". Note that the use of "Χ" in the "red" set corresponds to the letter "X" in Latin, while it differs from the later standard Greek alphabet, where Χ stands for /kʰ/, and Ψ stands for /ps/
It is not clear whether the process of adaptation from the Greek alphabet took place in Italy from the first colony of Greeks, the city of Cumae, or in Greece/Asia Minor. It was in any case a Western Greek alphabet. In the alphabets of the West, X had the sound value [ks], Ψ stood for [kʰ]; in Etruscan: X = [s], Ψ = [kʰ] or [kχ] (Rix 202-209).
The earliest Etruscan abecedarium, the Marsiliana d'Albegna (near Grosseto) tablet which dates to c. 700 BC, lists 26 letters corresponding to contemporary forms of the Greek alphabet which retained san and qoppa but which had not yet developed omega.
There is a common misconception that the word Xmas is a secular attempt to remove the religious tradition from Christmas by taking the "Christ" out of "Christmas".
Thorwald wasn't the first and only one who remarked on that...yet the explanation is incomplete
And actually I don't care for the labarum...used in warfare...
And ask anyone on the street...it's very unlikely, that the common man knows anything about the fine details here
so I could ask you then: Happy what???mas ....???
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