In Reply to: The Stalin and Hitler arguments posted by BB on June 24, 2007 at 15:09:55:
You may want to enlarge your knowledge about Hitler.
As far back as myself being a highschoolpupil/student I read in a history dictionary of my elder sister, that Hitler ultimately wanted to get rid of the churches (how many priests & Christian believers died in his camps I don't know...) Here is a link...though in German, it gives a quick glance about it too...I googled: Hitler Atheismus...by the way:
http://www.schmidt-salomon.de/atheismus.htm
It mentions a protocol from a secret meeting on 14.8.1943, intending to ultimately get rid of religious confessions with the final victory (Endsieg)...with Hitler as the Messiah...
Hitler seemed religious in his beginnings, earlier years...too little in the end.
Another link here, which has more quotes in English:
http://homepages.paradise.net.nz/mischedj/ca_hitler.html
Sorry, where is your googling-power/ability?....don't just quote half the truth or less....thanks!!!
It just proves, that you can think to be a believer, proceeding on the wrong path to become a total rotter.By the way even Luthers diatribes in his late years against the Jews are also very hard to fathom, that he had that gut as a supposed believer.I know of people, who very much question his genuine Christian faith for also more than this reason.
From what I know, Stalin turned against Christian faith already in his teenage years.
So did Stalin, Mao, Pol Pot...Hitler or who else,
did they make good Christian believers to kill innocent people?(No!!!)Also Jews know good and well: though shalt not "murder" (kill)...it was not some "righteous" defense war...whatever that really is or could be.Who were their stooges???Did you ponder about that? You know what kind of wars those monsters fought?Against their own people...not in the name of atheism, but with an atheistic heart & mind & their helpers had the same mind, it seems to me...so what difference does that make for the very sad end-result of their "wonderful" projects
to "help" their people/mankind....the "byproducts" are millions of dead people...none of them are your relatives, right?Or may be you would otherwise forego the luxury to philosophise at your comfortable desk whether Hitler was an atheist or not...David killed or let Uriah be killed & as a consequence God let not David's own son alive.Uriah was a Hetithite (not of Israel or a Jew) as you know...in other words, as a believer you cannot do as you please, according to your heart's desires, your own lust.
A very bad sample is then corrected...sooner or later. I believe in that & that's why I think, that believers should also have fruits of righteousness & love in their life.
If the fruits...the works are not there...not visible over a long time, I have doubts...though no flawless proofsystem, that someone is a genuine believer.I have trouble e.g. with preachers, who never smile...cause the Bible tells us a lot about
joy, as a fruit of the Spirit.
I met recently a very fine young female desk clerk in Bulgaria, who worked in the hotel I was staying for a week.She was always smiling, always cheerful.Other Bulgarians seemed to rather being a bit grimfaced...probably from a lot of hard work for little payment???
Anyway, it turned out, that she is with her family a regular church visitor....I would have bet a good sum of money, that she would be a believer.That is a light I can see, dear BB...
If you google about neon, you also learn or know already ,that it stems from the Greek and therefore it is your "new" light....or may be it has something of Simon & Garfunkel...sound of silence (I don't know) :
Hello darkness, my old friend,
Ive come to talk with you again,
Because a vision softly creeping,
Left its seeds while I was sleeping,
And the vision that was planted in my brain
Still remains
Within the sound of silence.
In restless dreams I walked alone
Narrow streets of cobblestone,
neath the halo of a street lamp,
I turned my collar to the cold and damp
When my eyes were stabbed by the flash of
A neon light
That split the night
And touched the sound of silence.
And in the naked light I saw
Ten thousand people, maybe more.
People talking without speaking,
People hearing without listening,
People writing songs that voices never share
And no one deared
Disturb the sound of silence.
Fools said i,you do not know
Silence like a cancer grows.
Hear my words that I might teach you,
Take my arms that I might reach you.
But my words like silent raindrops fell,
And echoed
In the wells of silence
And the people bowed and prayed
To the neon God they made.
And the sign flashed out its warning,
In the words that it was forming.
And the signs said, the words of the prophets
Are written on the subway walls
And tenement halls.
And whisperd in the sounds of silence.
Talking about dreams: what is your stance regarding scepticism?I have a book, the philosophy of scepticism...it contains pieces of R.Descartes, Thomas Nagel and Barry Strout....it also contains pieces of Anti-scepticists.
What do you think we really know?...could it be all a dream, like the scepticists could put it, or like the/our brain in the tank...receiving some stimuli by some "mad" scientist.What do you know BB, what would they (the above three) say, you claim to know?Aren't you a bit too positivistic???
Did you ever care to read about/from Gödel?
...also the quote of Weinberg leaves me disappointed with such a great guy...so people are either in the good or bad group without religion?
What about evil people doing good things...possible or not according to Weinberg?Well, I rather read the Bible or other more feeding stuff.
I read there, that "good" Peter did something "naughty"/bad & received forgiveness....that is very comforting for me as such a sinner.Thank God.
Oh you don't need that??!You're belonging to the goodie-troop...(Weinberg-definition) Don't you desert that fine troop...