In Reply to: Re: God exists posted by Peace on January 21, 2010 at 16:07:40:
Peace:
I only wanted to engage your thinking as well as your beliefs. It appears that I have done so.
Yes, the logic I proposed about your postion, as I understood the words you wrote, and the only logic I could derive from them at the time, from the plain meaning, was correct. No brag, just objective logic, as far as possible, from my POV.
And, yes, I remember Colossians 2; the whole chapter, includinng the "Set Card verses" (6-8)we had to learn to intimidate "mere "Jesus People" and other "spiritual inferiors" whil in TF. I remember.
Another part of the chapter mentions people who are "puffed up" and intellectually pretentious, pretending to have "entered into those things they have NOT seen", or proved from the rigorous Greek philsophical point of view. Paul employed some irony here; yes. He turned the Greeks rules back on them, exposing their ignorance.
If you examine another time he confronted philosophers of this kind, he declared Jesus to the ones at Mars Hill in Athens. HE quoted them there own poets when he said, "In Him we live, adn move, and have our being"; atrtempting to bridge the gap bwetween their philosophies and demonic experiences, and the true God and His presence.
Paul also said that he was "set for the defense and confirmation of the Gospel", and he also reasoned from the Scriptures (OT) at eery public opportunity. In that sense, he decidely DID NOT "stay away from vain philosophies of men, etc. etc.", as you wrote.
You still continue the error I delineated, as if I must accept, a priori, that certain things cannot be known. No, we cannot know "as we are also known"; YET. THAT is true objectivity; if you will.
We CAN know definitely, as God reveals, and Scripture says so in many, many places. Otherwise a position of heresy must be taken concerning revelation knowledge. The Gospel and its philosophical (as in literally "the love of the truth", which is what the word means).
And, true science CANNOT point away from God. I will contest that wiwth anybody, as related (and will TRY to speak the truth in love"!:-))
I agree SOME with the rest of your belief construct, regarding general knowledge, scientific data like quantum mechanics' probabilities, and so on; but only in part.
Your statement that "The only people who know it all are those who know nothing" sounds very "Zen", but it also sounds like a real "load"; if you know what I mean.
And your mere belief does not negate/disprove my knowledge/experience/revelation from God (non-TF, of course! :-)). So, I cannot agree, with all intention of kindness, that mere belief is enough. I would have thought that TF membership would have purged that out of anyone, and driven them towards the more definite assurance that I am talking about.
I am thrilled that you say that " I believe in God and in His son Jesus the Christ".
More later.
OT2