In Reply to: Re: dark side of calvinism posted by mir on May 06, 2010 at 21:26:34:
mir...it'd be a very lengthy discussion and study indeed and timewise or other I'd be a bit "handicapped"...suffice it to say, that I already wrote in to WS in 1984 or so about my trouble understanding predestination ...standard letter was then "choice"
I tended to be almost an extreme calvinist..you have the supralapsarian and whatnot...
NO 1 for me was the absolute recognition of God's sovereignty in all aspects of our lives..He's all and I am totally dependant in everything...incomplete...all I have, I received...simple matter.
The question is how much does He "interfere/interact" in every "second" of your life...kind of a "robot for God?"...I realised, the more I followed extreme predestination...the more I blamed God for everything...for HE didn't prevent...although HE could have...(omnipotency)...I got "hearttrouble" in all that accusing so to speak...I figured, it'd be about time to step back from such rigorism and may be look into the many aspects of God...and one is HIS love of the 1.Corinthian 13 kind...shown also in John 3:16
Since you already mentioned Ephesians...I realised reading again and again the letter...one day it dawned on me...I am predestined i n HIM
verse 1:11 etc....Jesus is the bridegroom...we're the bride...very wonderful them in Eph 5...marvellous...We're taken from His rib so to speak...if I may conclude that...but really predestined is HE and I when I react to the call...kind of takes both...but above all His will...for sure
I reacted upon the preaching of the word...the word never comes back void...it's becoming alive through the ministry of the WORD...however also MT 13 is true...one of my favourite allegories.
(some is seed of the enemy...quite a big range of thoughts)
From acts 17 follows, that God wants men to repent...not just some...
I figure some must be the sure pray of the devil...but God is not tempted and tempts no one...also very important to note...whosoever will in the end of revelation too
in Mt 23:37 it says they didn't want to...
Real love for me goes more along with some choice...some will to surrender, rather than running around like robots...which God could have done...even the sceptics think of the possibility, that we're just controlled by a mad scientist and all freedom is just an illusion...emphasis on mad scientist...that's not love either.
So we can weigh the scriptures and balance them against each other...I haven't done a complete analysis of all the relevant scriptures although I have tons of books and files about it...just not my time now for it...sometime...interesting subject...but also consider the fruit of the direct teachings...like Calvins reign in Geneva...
quite horrible...I'd say.
Calvinist also seem to claim, that we are completely dead in our sins...and to that I agree...however, if addressed like Lazarus e.g. one can come out of the tomb...I agree, it takes the Word...the gospel...the preaching...but it doesn't say necessarily...that the preaching should be reduced to some few...who could believe...all are addressed and people should repent...something Calvinists are not too strong about either, if I am not mistaken here...more may be later...
Mir are you sometimes peace here or mir only ; )