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ok. had some coffee...

Posted by ray on December 10, 2002 at 04:09:27

In Reply to: Still too angry posted by Jules on December 09, 2002 at 21:11:31:

jules, first of all, i want to be clear that i do of course feel resposible for having stayed in the family past the davidito letter, and was also personally much closer to other stuff that happened after that which if i had been in anyway morally alert to the obvious madness and seriously abusive situations both reported in worldwide family publications and personally aware of, then i believe i would have acted on behalf of my kids, and those of others. if you would like to see every adult who was a member during those years, or even exmember who was aware of it and did not mount a rescue mission , sent to jail, you may be well w/in your rights. if i focus too long and hard on some aspects of this history, suicide seems a fairly logical choice. but the picture is a little bigger than that, and my responsibilities to the present and future , if not greater than to the past, are at least the only ones i can do anything to influence from this point on.

you are completely w/in your rights to be angry w/ me, my generation in the fam, and the family today. you are under no moral onus to try and understand how or why any of this could have happened. but that issue is in my opinion key to MY acting morally, and effectively, from this point on.

right now some friends of mine,( that i believe you may have spoken with-bob & judy?)are involved in a very serious court case involving 2nd degree murder charges against a woman who thru obedience to a prophetic authority in her life,ended up starving her baby to death. the whole story is totally heartbreaking. but it also an extremely complicated one. they got involved as court appointed guardian ad lietem for the children of this cult, and ended up having to recommend placement of the kids in new homes. but later, due to their unique understanding of the issues surrounding religious cults and thought reform, have been asked to consult on her defense, as well as become involved in her life. she is now, after 2 years in jail , coming free of the incredible grip the cult had on her entire way of processing reality...needless to say, her suffering at the realization of her actions far more than any sentence the court may impose. but as b&j have explained it, if you are totally convinced that your obedience is the only way God will save your baby, if you really believe that, than what else would a parent who loves their child do? as they explain in a recent newsletter, "this all sounds so incredible to the average person on the outside, but such is the very nature of destructive cults.your world and beliefs are completely narrowed to the group/leaders interpretation of God and reality. It has been aptly stated, 'when you are inside the frame it is impossible to see the picture.'"

the point is that it is my belief that if one is to try and understand the past, than simply narrowing down the actions and framing them in terms of the way average citizens of western society would veiw them, you will miss the picture. if you take a wider veiw it does complicate things. your feelings of having been wronged are in no way devalued. but some grasp of the dynamics that went into it are necessary for ME to try and make moral judgements from this point on.

perhaps like the poster below,this is all just weaseling in your mind, i do not know. but why on earth would a weasel stick his head out of his hole in a place like this?

as far as actions that can be taken to try to stop the current family from continuing in abusive practices, or shielding criminals w/in its ranks, it is my opinion that the ramifications of such actions , the possibility that they will lead to the stated goal, and the question of collateral damage are all reasonable and moral questions to consider.

i am not sure if it is your intention to continue this discussion here. if so, i welcome it, and feel much could be gained. if not, it was at least nice to get a chance to dialogue. gotta drive the kids to school. later...