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Re: I don't get JoJo

Posted by Farmer on November 11, 2005 at 04:05:49

In Reply to: I don't get JoJo posted by Acheick on November 10, 2005 at 15:47:54:

Acheick, I don’t know where you were after the RNR, but I was in Germany…they didn’t do any serious FFing there...going to a loud discothek you can’t call FFing...the best looking single girls/women...adults where sent to Spain/ Tenerife those days...that time afterwards was
spent IMO with lots of freedom, where to witness, with whom where to live etc. Faithy & Juan pasted through Munic (ambassadors?), but that was more a “be nice” ever reminding yourself of the letter: your declaration of independence??...I thought about that after joining lots...because honestly, I didn’t find it always so attractive in I did have second thoughts...

In other words, there was lots of freedom before new leadership structures were set up...meanwhile VSs touring, to see how people were doing besides the refuge-farm thing, the
“imminent” atomic war, which scared us to leave Germany for the field...FFing in that environment??...remember, that on the stat forms even flirting with the eyes there was no super need for it, to do it the “Tenerife way” mentioned originally closed fields, difficult situations...wasn’t really like German...lit was still paying the bills...I mention that, because for me RNR & the must to FF doesn’t jive...for the area I lived in, not discounting your experience.

I am having a difficult time to read so many accounts of exers, be it SGAs or FGAs, often the time reference is missing.Germany, e.g. didn’t have for very long teenage girls/boys...the
earliest “indigeneous” couples are from 70/71, if not 72...who remained longer in...brings us
to 82 & later & their kids being teenagers....I mention that, because you loosely mention – no time reference- the “sharing” for teenagers.

I would plead for abstaining from/limiting the use of this conclusion by induction: I experienced this & that in TF in my area, the letters said that, hence it must have been everywhere like this....this could be theoretically, but isn’t consequently so & for that reason
I allow myself to protest here & you’re a witness for this & that & others a witness
for this & that...could be contradictary if misread, but may be we avoid getting close to the
calling of the other as liars, not that you did, pls. don’t get me wrong here....I would just say, that happened to be your experience & shrugging a bit the shoulders...time permitting I say my 2 cents also regarding FFing, as I was having some too close experiences...nobody can deny a sexually charged atmosphere.If someone is very poor & sees what he needs, does everybody become automatically a thief?No one really seems to claim that...same goes also for sexual abuse of little children.What ESJ witnessed is however not necessarily everyones observation, as no one really shared similar experiences here yet, not making it less true, but it shows, that the thoughteffort/theory of forcing into line all the TF homes at a particular time is actually not the 100% truth & a bit of a waste..causing just much steam.

Granted, the potentiality through the letters was real, hence the manifold abuse, however, unless the victims get very concrete when & where it happened, then it leaves room for ambiguousnees, cause the overall picture is clear: sexual abuse happened manifold, but the details are not clear of which field, area, home, when, so a lot of people guess & accuse each other (FGs among themselves for lack of details)...cause simply the abusers don’t seem to come in front...leaves unfortunately the victims with the job....very tough.

Your train of thought has one logical draw back I want to bring to attendance: If say, someone
is in a field, where leadership didn’t obey the rules,e.g FFing, Davidito-book & it gets replaced by “better” leaders, then there are certain logical consequences: If they really did their job very well, it means the leadership brought this person to do FFing & to sexually abuse children or they weren’t so “good” after all, meaning, there was still some leeway...what is the case in our own situations then?????Very strict leadership or some leniency??

The subject of the abuse behind closed doors is important, very important, but one thing I must repeat, either I was super tired from witnessing & always sound asleep as a single, but as there were open bedrooms everywhere, why did I not hear the corresponding sounds?Many possibilities still, but isn’t it a bit unfair, to suggest this & that must have happened everywhere, because one thinks people must have always zombielike done everything written.
If that’s the case, then this board should harbour also some abusers, just by some superficial statistical reasoning. Also, in 1985 or86 I was in Delhi sharing one little bedroom with dear English Joan, who was 15 at that time.In a home of people better world or so called, some forerunner of FC whatever...can’t remember all the abbreviations...pardon me pls....she was forced to share at the young age of 12, if I remember then homeshepherd thought, that was out of it...but they were outsiders so to speak...same weak handling of such seriousness...we talked about that....anyway, I never thought of sharing with her, although being beautiful, but I perceived it innerly as a real no where was I forced to do so & so???I don’t think she was on a sharingschedule....yet we know, as you said, it happened elsewhere.Should we mould/streamline TF according to our perception, from our limited experience, when TF was also a conglomerate of people with different readiness to obey...

Again that leaves the poor SGA victims in the tough spot to fill in the gaps, where FGAs don’t mention more facts of things behind open or closed doors...

If I get another beating for this post, then that may be it...I just think & feel this way & don’t feel to perform some “twisting” to suit everyone...the truth is what interests me & this is a severe topic of TF history.The Nazi-past is also superunpleasant...disgusting & awful...yet something to dig into, to learn about some other machinations of evil.